GWSIG Monthly Meeting Minutes/Meeting39
International Game Developers Association
Transcript of Meeting, Thursday 15 January 2008
The meeting took place online on Thursday, 15 January 2008, 5PM GMT, 12 Noon EST, 9am PST.
Attendees
- Aaron
- ChrisK
- CorvusE
- Dansky
- Joe_Chan
- JRob
- KimSparks
- LaurenL
- mollysauter
- Mykas0
- raynaa
- Reid
- Rubes
- sk
- Teh_Drew
- tobias_heussner
- TracySeamster
- wanderingscribe
- wendydespain
Transcript
JRob: hello
| ChrisK joined #IGDA-WSIG
| Mykas0 missed everyone
LaurenL: Hi everybody
| Rubes joined #IGDA-WSIG
CorvusE: As a reminder: http://www.igda.org/wiki/Game_Writers_SIG/five-year_plan
| Teh_Drew joined #IGDA-WSIG
wanderingscribe: Have people had chance to read the five year plan? http://www.igda.org/wiki/Game_Writers_SIG/five-year_plan
wanderingscribe: hi
Teh_Drew: I made it!
CorvusE: Welcome, Teh_Drew
Mykas0: wanderingscribe, not me :\
wanderingscribe: hurrah
| tobias_heussner joined #IGDA-WSIG
wanderingscribe: You can read it here - http://www.igda.org/wiki/Game_Writers_SIG/five-year_plan :)
wanderingscribe: Okay, let's start the ball rolling as we wait for people to arrive
wanderingscribe: what do people think our focus for the year should be?
CorvusE: Staying solvent in a down economy?
wanderingscribe: Education? Expanding membership? Hiring Hall? Jelly beans?
raynaa: jelly beans!
mollysauter: Jelly beans is good focus.
Teh_Drew: Getting new blood into the industry!
Reid: Somehow convincing project leads that writers need more influence on a project.
| Dansky joined #IGDA-WSIG
wanderingscribe: maybe both Drew and Reid's suggestions could be solved withh Jelly beans...
Teh_Drew: Dansky!
wanderingscribe: on a serious note though
raynaa: I think that falls under the importance of game writers
JRob: perhaps convincing companies that writers are not the ones you let go when the economy gets tight
wanderingscribe: I think we do need to provide resources for people entering the industry, but I hope the FAQs we'll come to later
Mykas0: wanderingscribe, may I just complain about something?
wanderingscribe: alongside the Hiring hall may help with that
Dansky: *waves*
wanderingscribe: yes Mykas
wanderingscribe: hi dansky
tobias_heussner: hi dansky
| CorvusE waves at Dansky
Mykas0: I always felt, and still feel, by looking at the plan, that you forget those who do not directly work in in-game content
Mykas0: i.e. the people who write the manuals, those who write reviews/FAQs, etc
Mykas0: and believe me, there are games with godamm awful manuals out there
CorvusE: Well Mykas0, perhaps you need to take a more active role in ensuring those people's needs are met by the SIG.
wanderingscribe: the focus of the SIG is always open for discussion, so we can look to widen our definitions
wanderingscribe: we have looked to include some of those things in our script library and other pushes
wanderingscribe: most writers end up writing copy and text for manuals at some point in their career and so need guidance
wanderingscribe: and there are a lot of reviewers out there who could do with guides as well
mollysauter: I have to go early. I'll read the transcript later. Have a good meeting, guys!
wanderingscribe: maybe we should add resources for them too?
CorvusE: By mollysauter
wanderingscribe: see you molly
| mollysauter quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")
Mykas0: well, I can help with that - my reviews are not that good, but I have quite an experience with guides, too
wanderingscribe: Reid, any suggestions as to how we could continue to promote writers to the industry?
wanderingscribe: That's great, Rob are you still coordinating the script library contributions?
Dansky: I know that we periodically re-affirm that manual writing, etc. is an important aspect of game writing. Where we've fallen down is in finding A) initiatives with value to those folks and B)folks willing to pick up those initiatives.
wanderingscribe: Drewm did I address what you were thinking?
| Aaron joined #IGDA-WSIG
Teh_Drew: I had an idea long ago, but nothing really came from it. If the SIG could somehow politely ask employers using the hiring hall to open an internship, I think that would help
wanderingscribe: Maybe we could at least start by listing places that offer internships
Teh_Drew: Scribe, did you address new blood?
wanderingscribe: does anyone know of anywhere?
wanderingscribe: that's what I'm asking :) See my first replies above about current initiatives :)
Mykas0: hum... most websites for the companies tend to offer those, from time to time
Mykas0: Nintendo Europe had a few, some weeks ago, for example
Teh_Drew: I've found a few places (Heatwave Interactive for example) that offer production internships, but not so much for writing
Reid: Wanderingscribe, I'm thinking. Does anyone have a list of common statements and arguments against the need for writers from executives and project leads? If we knew why some were against, we could come up with solutions to persuade them otherwise.
JRob: My contribution was sort of to stimulate the mailing list discussion on the contributions, but no actual material, uh, materialized as a result
Dansky: I suspect this is a case where the candidate - or the organization - will have to convince companies of the benefit.
wanderingscribe: Reid - we compiled one from the list. It was due to go on the website, but...like many things, disappeared as we have been waiting for the new site
wanderingscribe: I think we put it together with answers for the first Austin Writing conference
Dansky: Where the SIG can do work is in laying the groundwork - do up a fact sheet on the benefits of a writing intern, maybe formalize the program to provide a pool of candidates. But there's a lot of knocking on doors that will have to be done.
wanderingscribe: Does anyone still have a copy?
JRob: was any Austin Writing conference output archived anywhere in general?
Reid: wanderingscribe, I would like a copy. Just I can familiarize myself with the history of the SIG.
wanderingscribe: The door knocking is often the problem...all such drives live and die on the enthusiasm of individual volunteers
raynaa: is there a timeline on the new site yet? I know it's been in the works for about a year now...
JRob: or input? was that talked about on the mailing list beforehand?
wanderingscribe: wendy is the most up-to-date on that
JRob: "any time now" is what wendy usually says they have been telling her
wanderingscribe: I know we are due for a launch 'any time now' :)
CorvusE: The new site is progressing
CorvusE: The team working on it now seems pretty sharp
Teh_Drew: I'd be willing to do the door knocking, but I'd need someone with experience with fact-sheet creation (looking into the Hobbit's eyes) to assist in...creating a fact-sheet.
wanderingscribe: great, thanks Drew
Dansky: Has anyone else here ever hired an intern? :-)
wanderingscribe: let us look at following that up.
Dansky: Right, talk to me afterwards, Drew.
wanderingscribe: So far the suggestions for this year's focus are getting new blood into the industry and promoting writers to the industry
wanderingscribe: any further thoughts on these, or other suggestions? :D
Mykas0: not me, apart from what I've said before
wanderingscribe: okay
Reid: Here's an idea. What if the SIG made a small game to showcase the value of writers when they have more creative control and are brought in early?
wanderingscribe: item number 2....volunteers :)
Teh_Drew: Oooo
Teh_Drew: Reid - I like it....do we have programmers?
Mykas0: I was wondering about that... call me dumb if you want, but... volunteers for what?
Rubes: I was going to mention something similar, Reid.
CorvusE: why not use Inform?
Teh_Drew: CorvusE - Which is?
CorvusE: then you wouldn't need programmers--just writers
wanderingscribe: :) in general we are looking for two types of volunteer...those willing to volunteer for anything who we can assign to quiet projects
CorvusE: Teh_Drew: an IF engine that parses semi-natural english
JRob: Inform is still programming, no matter how disguised the syntax
Reid: I'm sure we can find programmers, but remember, the emphasis would be on writing... not much need for a lot of programmers I would hope.
wanderingscribe: and volunteers with a burning passion for something who are willing to pursue ideas, such as Drew volunteering to help with the intern idea
CorvusE: True JRob, but it's programming in a writerly style.
JRob: see inform-fiction.org
Teh_Drew: (blushing)
JRob: I know all about it
wanderingscribe: I think the game idea has legs, it is something we could support and promote, but I think it would be a side project rather than a central aim
Mykas0: wanderingscribe, 'k, thanks for explaining
Aaron: I might have a different option. We've developed a text game engine in-house that's mostly XML-driven. It supports sound and music, too. So far it only has a Flash client.
CorvusE: Hey wanderingscribe, I'm volunteering to manage the GDC contact list again
| wendydespain joined #IGDA-WSIG
Reid: I can agree with that wanderingscribe.
JRob: hey, it's wendy
| CorvusE waves at wendydespain
Mykas0: sure, the game idea has legs, but... would it really work? Let's be reasonable - even if we make a game with an amazing plot, will people care?
wendydespain: I think I have finally successfully arrived
Mykas0: hi, wendy! :)
wanderingscribe: could we move the game forward with a separate group...Reid, Drew and others, could you chase that up between you?
wanderingscribe: :)
wanderingscribe: hi wendy
tobias_heussner: Hi wendy
wanderingscribe: Lets cover more volunteers as we move down the agenda and see where we're missing people
wanderingscribe: any help in bringing in more people is welcome too!
wendydespain: not that I know what's going on, but I was going to suggest that a game committee get together in a chat room for their own meeting next week or something
wanderingscribe: so...item 3 - Hiring Hall
wanderingscribe: can anyone give us an update?
JRob: I think the update is that there is no movement since the last meeting
wanderingscribe: This one has been quiet for the last few meetings, is it still Sande who is running this one?
Teh_Drew: Isn't Sande the hiring hall guru?
Teh_Drew: time delay...the Brits always win
JRob: yeah, although her focus has shifted to launching the game design SIG in a way
wanderingscribe: As this one has stalled a little is someone willing to step in to lead this in her place as she is now pulling extra weight?
JRob: also, Hiring Hall is sort of pending the new website so that it can be re-launched in a re-discussed form and focus
wanderingscribe: All help would be welcome
wanderingscribe: Wendy...ay more concrete news on the website?
wendydespain: yeah, the website redux is still moving ahead. there should be a beta test in february.
wendydespain: there have been a few bumps in the road, but I think we'll get it on or around GDC time
| sk joined #IGDA-WSIG
sk: hello, sorry I'm late
wendydespain: but that's just me being optimistic. Jason hasn't given me that date.
wanderingscribe: what does that mean in terms of a proper launch...most initiatives seem to be waiting for its completion to move forward
wanderingscribe: any hiring hall volunteers? Could someone summarise the project for everyone here?
wendydespain: i mean, i think they're hoping for a proper launch around GDC
wendydespain: Rob was working on hiring hall with Sande
sk: I'm here
wendydespain: oh, sk are you Sande?
sk: I think the issue is that Hiring Hall was morphing
sk: Yes, Sande
wanderingscribe: hey Sande :)
| KimSparks joined #IGDA-WSIG
tobias_heussner: Hi Sande
KimSparks: Hi. Sorry I'm late.
wanderingscribe: Could you summarise it for us please Sande
wanderingscribe: hi kim and thanks for coming
sk: Initially, it was for people looking for writers to post... However, we get those on the list_serv. It seems people want it the other way around.
Teh_Drew: I would love to help with the Hiring Hall, but I don't want to take on too much and flop. I'll definitely be working WITH the hiring hall after the details of the intern situation is ironed out.
sk: something that's on the page and the Wiki already... A directory of links to people's portfolios or pages.
wanderingscribe: thanks Drew
Teh_Drew: "Sparks, I can't go back to margerine." - SeaLab 2021
sk: So, firstly, I think that needs to be decided is what direction should this be taking or is it completely separate...
sk: Do we make it easier for companies to post the need for writers, or do we make it easier for companies to search for a writer?
wendydespain: or both...
sk: or both
wanderingscribe: grand, thanks sande, lets put this one on the back boiler off the agenda until the website is done...in the meantime jobs can be posted on the list. We can then take the work you've done forward on the website once this is up, does that make sense?
wanderingscribe: both
Mykas0: sk, I think we should go for both
sk: OK, well, this will have to wait until we see what we get with the website and wiki.
tobias_heussner: I think both will be good, but to get this running I think let's try to make it easier for companies to find us
| TracySeamster joined #IGDA-WSIG
Reid: I need to get to another meeting, adios all.
tobias_heussner: bye
wanderingscribe: GDC 2009 – Write Club, party game, book signing
| TracySeamster quit (Client Quit)
wendydespain: also, we already have a page for Writers for Hire
wendydespain: and we can continue using that until we have a better option
wendydespain: it does sound like Hiring Hall may need to wait until the new website is a reality
wanderingscribe: Wendy?
wanderingscribe: And of course we are....looking for a volunteer to coordinate things on the ground at GDC - organise beers, meet ups, help people with advice etc
wanderingscribe: thanks reid
| TracySeamster joined #IGDA-WSIG
CorvusE: I'll handle the contact list for GDC
Dansky: I prefer my beers disorganized, in a frothy sort of way.
| Reid quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")
CorvusE: (and prove that I can learn from my mistakes)
wanderingscribe: thanks corvus
wendydespain: I believe Andy held this role at Austin, and we called it Cruise Director
| TracyS joined #IGDA-WSIG
wendydespain: but I think Andy isn't going to make it to GDC?
CorvusE: I won't be able to be cruise directore
wanderingscribe: sadly I won't be at GDC
CorvusE: But I can help
JRob: well, we'd take the Writers For Hire page and convert it into that bit of the New Hiring Hall, when it comes time, perhaps
| TracySeamster quit (Client Quit)
| TracyS quit (Client Quit)
CorvusE: I'll be the Cruise Director's clip board
JRob: (sorry, late)
ChrisK: Are we considering holding Write Club at John's Grill, or is that no longer an option?
wanderingscribe: anyone here going to GDC?
JRob: alas no Andy
wendydespain: i'll be at GDC (somehow)
KimSparks: I don't think I'll be able to make it this year, though Rob and Coray and I were going to work on something for Write Club.
| TracySeamster joined #IGDA-WSIG
JRob: yeah I think last meeting I volunteered to be ... something ... for Write Club
wendydespain: Corvus, it may not hurt to start that contact list ASAP
JRob: also I'm playing host at the writers meet and greet event as it is
KimSparks: We were going to work on a group challenge, I think. Let me check the transcript from last meeting.
sk: Is Write Club what you'll be doing for the Writers SIG roundtable?
Aaron: I'll be going to GDC... if I get my latest project done on time. My boss is holding GDC hostage :)
Teh_Drew: Funds are too low to support a trip to San Fran :(
CorvusE: Okay wendydespain, I'll fire it up next week
wanderingscribe: Um...it sounds like you're sort of cruise directing already...
wendydespain: the Writers SIG Roundtable is going to be a SIG meeting - like this one, but in person
Mykas0: Can I attend, too?
JRob: everyone in the same room, all chatting with each other on their laptops
wanderingscribe: Rob
TracySeamster: Can we all bring iphones or the internet to get an authentic web experience?
TracySeamster: :)
wendydespain: Write Club was going to be after hours in a pub or restaurant
Mykas0: JRob, lol, that could be awkward
JRob: hmm, the trick with me cruise directing is that I don't know the city, or that area of the city, so I can't be responsible for directing people to pubs or restaurants
wendydespain: the fastest typist in the room may get nominated to take it to a chat room or second life or something :-)
TracySeamster: Head to Chinatown where it'll be less congested.
wanderingscribe: the laptop might be distracting
wanderingscribe: could someone give suggestions to Rob? That's what I had to do
CorvusE: I'll do another Google map with restaurants and pubs
JRob: I can play the part of the Tall Guy that stands there looking like he at least knows who the guy is who knows where to go
CorvusE: I think we can share adding things to Google maps now too
wendydespain: Tracy, are you going to be at GDC? Do you want to be Cruise Director? :-)
CorvusE: so people can leave notes
JRob: I tend to attract people who need to wander up to a figure of vague authority just by being tall
JRob: and wearing a hat
wanderingscribe: What that be okay Rob?...don't want to volunteer you, just sounded like you were practically there already
TracySeamster: I'm not sure if I'm going; I can't afford it at regular prices so I'm hoping to be picked as a volunteer this year.
Mykas0: if we may say that without getting slapped, should wendy be the one doing the job of cruise director?
JRob: well I can give it a shot, and if I fail miserably people will volunteer someone else next time
CorvusE: JRob: Add a loud plaid sport coat and a curly moustache and see what happens then!
TracySeamster: If I went I'm tall, too, and can point up the streets and stuff.
Mykas0: I mean, wendy probably knows more about it than all of us together...
wendydespain: I've been Cruise Director before and failed miserably
CorvusE: JRob: Let's coordinate on that, eh?
CorvusE: JRob: You handle the outreach and I'll help with logistics?
JRob: yeah technically I'll be going "wendy, corvus, what do I tell everybody?" every few minutes
wendydespain: I love it when a plan comes together
JRob: Ok
TracySeamster: hehehe
CorvusE: We'll be the Zaphod of Cruise Directors
JRob: heh
wanderingscribe: Rob and Coray could you work out the game outside the meeting?
wanderingscribe: Thank you for volunteering Corvus and Rob :)
wanderingscribe: SIG visibility - any ideas for ways to promote the SIG?
Dansky: *wakes up* Might be worth canvassing the list for "favorite spots" from previous GDC attendees.
wanderingscribe: and is anything happening with the quarterly?
Teh_Drew: semi-pornographic ads with WSIG all over them?
Dansky: Also, I'll be running the Writers' Roundtables again, which could be convenient meetpoints.
wanderingscribe: Good idea thanks rumpledansky
CorvusE: Good idea, Dansky. I'll add that to the contact sheet info
wendydespain: one last thing about GDC - mostly just to let everyone know, i think AK Peters is going to try to organize a book signing for our new book
wanderingscribe: are you volunteering to make those ads Drew?
TracySeamster: Ooh, I want everyone else's autograph on a copy =(
wanderingscribe: great stuff rich
Dansky: We really need to get people talking about the book on their blogs, etc. in advance of the release to build some buzz.
wendydespain: and release will be at GDC09
Teh_Drew: Make them? I've got templates!
TracySeamster: Do we have a more definitive release day?
wanderingscribe: A signed copy would be great
TracySeamster: oh, cool!
wanderingscribe: anyone have blogs they can promote the book on?
TracySeamster: I have one, and we can all twitter about it :D
wanderingscribe: thanks Tracy :)
wendydespain: i have to say, this book really rocks
Teh_Drew: Hahaha...I've got one. that should up our visibility by 1
Rubes: *blush*...what's the book, again?
sk: very cool. The book will be there?
TracySeamster: @teh_Drew...yeah, I may get my sister to buy a copy out of guilt ;D
wanderingscribe: It examines writing for different genres rubes :)
wanderingscribe: Anything needed on the quarterly?
Mykas0: I wanted to buy it, but it's too expensive for me :(
wanderingscribe: Anything we can do to get the SIG and articles onto websites and into magazines?
wendydespain: now and then we tap into the vast experience of the SIG and get people together to write a book. Our latest book is about the differences in writing for videogame genres
Teh_Drew: Beth sent an email a week or two ago...don't remember it clearly though
wanderingscribe: Having established that there is a dirth of proper news out there :)
wendydespain: Beth was looking for art for the cover
Rubes: ah, thanks.
Teh_Drew: Ah, yes
TracySeamster: I was just going to ask about the cover
wendydespain: the cover of the Quarterly, that is
wendydespain: the subject of the Quarterly is Independent Games iirc
wanderingscribe: I thought Drew was posing for that as well?
TracySeamster: Maybe we should ask folks who had all those good news updates about getting jobs if they'd like the sig to press release those?
wendydespain: so it's a bit of a puzzle what to put on the cover
TracySeamster: or something similar?
wendydespain: that's a great idea Tracy
JRob: I've mentioned the book on Facebook at least once. I was all happy when I signed the contract because I felt professional-writery
Teh_Drew: (blushing again) Andy, you know me too well, sir
wendydespain: um, want to write it up? :-)
TracySeamster: lol
| raynaa quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")
wanderingscribe: We've sort of looked at the website already, but I'd like to pick up the FAQ thing mentioned on the mail list
wendydespain: feel free to talk about the book in every other breath now :-)
TracySeamster: I suppose, although I don't know if we already have a PR list to send it to. And I suppose we'd need permission from each writer...but it was so cool to see all that good news.
wanderingscribe: this would be a great thing to pursue once we have the website
wanderingscribe: Do you mean the next book...book 4 Wendy? ;)
wendydespain: let's talk about in in email Tracy. drop me a line.
wanderingscribe: *Ducks*
TracySeamster: ok, Wendy
wendydespain: did you say something Andy? I didn't hear that...
wanderingscribe: :P
wendydespain: we can still post things to our existing website
wendydespain: i don't think that should slow us down with the FAQx
wanderingscribe: Okay...I'll bring things to any other business
wendydespain: FAQx
wendydespain: FAQs
wanderingscribe: For FAQsake
wendydespain: wait, did we already talk about the Volunteer Coordinater?
TracySeamster: lol
Dansky: *scampers off*
JRob: We can talk about it again
TracySeamster: I vote for FAQsake!
| Dansky quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")
wanderingscribe: that would be Rob and Corvus working together?
wendydespain: ah, no. that's Cruise Director.
JRob: someone asked "what are volunteers?"
TracySeamster: heh...I thought Dansky was scampering off due to Vol Coord coming up as a topic
wanderingscribe: ah....
wendydespain: Volunteer Coordinator is a new scheme I've come up with
wanderingscribe: more volunteers (waits for people to step backwards...)
wanderingscribe: Aha, go wendy
wendydespain: but i don't know if it's a good idea, so I wanted to throw it out to yall and see what you thought
Teh_Drew: hey all, I'm out. Dansky, email you later for intern goodness
Teh_Drew: oh, he's already gone
wendydespain: occaisionally I have people email me and say they want to volunteer
wendydespain: and I email back and say "great! pick something and go ahead!"
wendydespain: and then there's silence
Mykas0: wendydespain, do you mean... someone who is in charge of directing all the volunteeers?
| Teh_Drew quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")
wendydespain: and i'm so busy i don't follow up properly
JRob: yeah, volunteers need to be gently led or forcibly pointed
wendydespain: so i'm wondering if we created a new position of Volunteer Coordinater
TracySeamster: we could put all the volunteers into a spreadsheet muahahahaha
wendydespain: hee
JRob: masses of potential energy but they have no steering mechanism or gyroscopes
wendydespain: someone who is less busy than me - or better at interpersonal communication
wendydespain: just someone to help people find initiatives and guide them into doing something useful
TracySeamster: everyone is less busy than you Wendy :D
wendydespain: i fear we're missing people who want to do something but just need a little more guidance
wendydespain: it's true, I fear, Tracy. :-)
TracySeamster: Do we have a list of folks who have volunteered previously?
wendydespain: I think this is an area I'm just not doing that great at, and wondering if it's something I can delegate
| ChrisK quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")
TracySeamster: Cause I could put them into a google spreadsheet, seriously
wanderingscribe: that would be a great start tracy
CorvusE: I think it sounds like a great idea, but not one I have the spare cycles to deal with
wanderingscribe: thanks
wendydespain: i could do a search of my email to find people I've dropped
CorvusE: So thank goodness for TracySeamster!
TracySeamster: but I don't know all the initiatives by heart so I'd have to do research :D
TracySeamster: lol
JRob: yeah even I am not going to raise my hand this time
wendydespain: Rob has been working on the wiki
tobias_heussner: I like the spreadsheet idea, but we still need someone who maintains this
JRob: go Tracy
wanderingscribe: research is one of our initiatives
TracySeamster: while you're all wandering around at GDC I'll be assigning you all volunteer tasks ;)
wendydespain: you might be able to work with Rob
wendydespain: yay for coordination!
wendydespain: i think you just got yourself a title, Tracy
TracySeamster: wait...did I just volunteer for something? aiee
wanderingscribe: and bang on the hour
wendydespain: we can try it out for a while and see how it goes
wanderingscribe: so I'll say thanks all volunteers
JRob: if you get something I can blop up onto the Wiki I'd be happy to do that. and give it a link on the wiki top page maybe
CorvusE: TracySeamster, the VolCoord
wanderingscribe: thanks for coming
TracySeamster: hehehe
wanderingscribe: bangs gavel and says, meeting done, thanks for being here and feel free to stay and chat
TracySeamster: ok, I'll email wendy and start takin names!
wanderingscribe: yah for the SIG in 2009!!!!!
wendydespain: :-)
JRob: thanks andy
